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27/10/2007, 10:49 S&S Joined on 27/10/2007 Posts 1 Health Care reforms! I was disgusted to read in this month's FPN, bottom right of page 10, comments by one Duncan Campbell, Associate Director of Siddalls, about the reforms not affecting most British residents in France.  What about those who have been paying into the CMU and are now being kicked out, is this not a change to previous practice??  Those who have been paying into CMU and have pre-existing conditions who will not be covered by Private Health Insurance companies, if indeed they can even get cover??  Do they not count?       Report

27/10/2007, 10:56 cooperlola Joined on 05/05/2006 72 - Sarthe - home of les 24 heures du Mans Posts 7,604 Re: Health Care reforms! This is not the first person who has - how can I put it - "an interest" in not putting people off the idea of moving to France, who has been a little careless with the truth. I suppose that he is technically correct in that the majority of UK nationals here are either on E forms or are working but I agree with your sentiments, S&S, there appears to be a huge number of people who will be affected and it's misleading to suggest this.  I feel a letter to the editor coming on...... Healthcare Issues Site    Report

27/10/2007, 11:31 Tony F Dordogne Joined on 10/04/2005 Small village in the Dordogne, near St Cyprien Posts 1,994 Re: Health Care reforms! Though of course it's also in Archant's best, i.e. commercial, interests to keep the story alive about any forthcoming changes being effectively ineffective. Like all the adverts they continue to print for people who work in France without being properly registered here. Tony F Dordogne (24)    Report

27/10/2007, 11:46 Deimos Joined on 15/11/2005 France Posts 2,731 Re: Health Care reforms! To be honest, it is difficult to know if he is right or wrong and the extent. There are people who will be better off under the new scheme (myself for example). How many will benefit and how any lose and to what extent depends on the statistical nature of those moving here. Of course there are those with chronic conditions and with conditions that will affect their insurance cover and those really do need to be sorted. However, those are probably the minority and I would suspect that the majority in the "inactif" are probably healthy and will not have a big problem getting private health insurance - but I have no evidence for that, just "I suspect". Where the numbers lie is difficult as we are almost certainly getting a biased view here. Many not affected (or better off) with these changes will probably not be posting. It might just be that this guy has a better appreciation of the situations of a larger and more "cross-sectional" sample of those moving to France. Maybe not. Please do not interpret my comments as suggesting that it is not worth fighting these changes. Despite being better of under the new regime, I am strongly against the changes. Apart from those who lose cover for existing conditions, I think that private insurance is not the way any society should be going. We should be able to threat those members of our society who become ill and it should not be a subject to private business profit considerations and the needs of shareholder dividends. Ian Copyright Deimos. All rights reserved    Report

27/10/2007, 11:51 cooperlola Joined on 05/05/2006 72 - Sarthe - home of les 24 heures du Mans Posts 7,604 Re: Health Care reforms! Ian, I think your analysis is probably correct, as said above - I would imagine the majority of Britons here will hardly notice the change, and the wealthier, healthy ones will probably save a few euros.  But, yes, the problem with this is that the poor or the ill are being hit the hardest, and their futures are in the hands of profit-making bodies - morally, if for no other reason - the legislation therefore STINKS! Healthcare Issues Site    Report

27/10/2007, 14:08 rothrugby Joined on 19/09/2007 Champagne Mouton (16) France Posts 89 Re: Health Care reforms! Having read the last two messages- how can anyone be better off paying for 100% cover than paying for a complementaire?  I've yet to see any insurance quote which is less than what we currently pay, for the same level of cover. And yes, I'm one of the unlucky ones. Came over 4.5 years ago with no problems, now got cancer.  I'm not alone!!!    Report

27/10/2007, 14:29 Maricopa Joined on 01/10/2007 Minervois, Hérault Posts 782 Re: Health Care reforms! Unfortunately rothrugby, there ARE wealthy people who retire to france to whom 8% represents considerably more than the cost of private medical cover.  If only we were all in that position!  The rest of us have much less choice, particularly those who are in the postion, like yourself, for whom private medical insurance will be difficult, if not impssible to obtain, and if you could, would probably NOT be able to afford it.  As I am able to work, that is my way out, though the house renovations will have to go on the back burner, but for those like yourself, FIGHT is the way ahead, and why it is imperative that EVERYONE does their bit Maricopa Never assume anything, it only makes an assofuandme    Report

27/10/2007, 14:42 cooperlola Joined on 05/05/2006 72 - Sarthe - home of les 24 heures du Mans Posts 7,604 Re: Health Care reforms! Yes, Maricopa, that was my point.  Those on high incomes (60,000 euros or so) are probably not going to notice a big difference between the cost of private healthcare - 8% of that sort of income, plus the cost of top-up, probably reflects the average cost of full cover for a couple in their late 50's, early 60's.  Ergo only middle and low income earners, plus more importantly, the sick, are really affected by the reforms.  What do I call that? -  discrimination against the ill and the less well off. On the campaigning subject - I did a round robin e-mail to everybody in my address book yesterday - so far 8 people whom I know have signed the petition in less than 12 hours.  Think about it guys and gals and get e-mailing! http://petitions.pm.gov.uk/healthinFrance/ Healthcare Issues Site    Report

27/10/2007, 14:47 Tony F Dordogne Joined on 10/04/2005 Small village in the Dordogne, near St Cyprien Posts 1,994 Re: Health Care reforms! As I said, I think in private, to somebody a couple of weeks ago, what we're talking about here is a few thousand Brits - white, middle class, early retired and comparatively well-off, especially by French rural standards - and within the few thousand, an even smaller number that have developed a maladie longue duree. The real problem here is who's going to stick their necks out for those/us people?  Whilst everybody will sympathise with rothrugby and people in his position, the French have effectively covered their backs by including their own national inactifs in this as well so they will be treated in exactly the same way. I think it's a battle worth fighting.  It doesn't effect me at all, I came here with an E121 because of my health so all I can do is support the campaign and make sure that people in the same position as me get everything that they're entitled to, hence my interest in the DLA stuff. Taking apart each communication, right, wrong or mistaken, with the various CPAM offices isn't getting us anywhere.  We need to wait until CPAM central sends the definitive document out to their local offices so we have a clear target and then have one or two people who will get the information, work their way through it and post definitive statements, not the current this/that office says this/that stuff. I'm really going to stick my neck out here.  I don't think the French government will change their mind and despite the 5 year rule (as far as I can see, that's the only way to remain here on the current system and then the Government has to agree it) the French government will, I think, stick with their policy.  Sarkosy CANNOT, from a political point of view, be seen to cave in to a load of  well off (French or other EU citizens) who can leave work early, pay 8% contributions and remain with their health cover.  If he does this to the French inactifs, he must do it to all other nationalities as well and I think that he will keep going. We must start working with the French inactifs on this - being seen to be whinging Brits just isn't enough.  Why should the French or Brits support us, financially or politically, with our early retirement, aspirational life styles if we stay in our English communities?  If the French inactifs, trade unions, associations demonstrate in Paris, Marseilles or Lyon, we need to be seen to be with them and we need to find the other nationalities that may be effected by this and get them involved.  All we're doing at the moment is campaigning as a small, sectional, partisan and nationalistic interest group and we are in danger of re-inforcing stereotypes. So, what's plan B?  I know people are trying to get quotes from assurance companies etc., but as a campaign we need to know what our fall back is - we must have a plan in case this doesn't get changed.   Edit:  Sorry, my trade union, campaigning in local and central government agitation experience has started to surface again!!!! Tony F Dordogne (24)    Report

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