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18/07/2005, 20:00 Opel Fruit Joined on 20/03/2005 Posts 339 RE: Oil Heating, Hot water production and plumbing “funnies” in France Soft-solder is not allowed on Sanitary fittings here. You must use lead-free, which means 97% Tin - Hard solder. It is also NOT a good idea to use soft solder on French Sanitary plumbing, because the pressure is generally between 5 and 7 bar. Soft-Solder at 65deg C is only specified to 7 bar. Soft solder is fine for Central Heating and is widely used, for ease and cost. Injectors (Gicleurs) are not always available for every burner to run on paraffin. So my advice is to buy a burner/boiler sold for Red diesel fioul. Chances are you will still have to change the size of injector to suit the output requirements as I have already stated. They only cost 5-7 Euros. Unfortunately, few bother, to the detriment of the client's pockets or comfort. I have also mentioned the need for an inhibitor, and these are available with/without an antifreeze in them. Provided the system is adequately insulated, there should be no problems with freezing. We always use two frost stats, one sensing the air near the boiler if that is sited in an outbuilding or similar, and one on the return pipe in the form of a pipe stat. I'm not sure why the RCB should trip - the Central Heating should be on its own 6A breaker....   Opel Fruit, Dept. 53    Report

26/07/2005, 12:10 Renaud Joined on 23/08/2004 Barnes / Mirambeau Posts 631 RE: Oil Heating, Hot water production and plumbing “funnies” in France The plumber tendering for putting a boiler and central heating in our house came up with an alternative that would cost an extra 7,000 euros. I asked for a translation / explanation of what this was from the French half of our architectes and she came up with:   The pompe à chaleur can replace the gaz. Still we need a boiler, but the principle is to capture the energy in the soil, by a trench in the garden. This system is of course more expensive than a gaz installation, but the source of energy is free and you don't need to buy the gaz every year. Furthermore, it allows the cooling of the house during the summer. The plancher chauffant is also rafraîchissant.   The English half of our architectes  explains: This is a fairly old technology but has only recently become economic, partly due to government intervention giving grants to encourage wider use of the system.   The systems works by taking a small amount of residual heat from an area of ground with pipes in trenches at about 1 metre depth.    This heat is then concentrated by the heat pump to raise the temperature in the central heating system.    The rafraîchissant  bit means that the system can work in reverse and take heat from the house to cool it in summer. Gus www.relax-in-france.com    Report

26/07/2005, 15:01 Deimos Joined on 15/11/2005 France Posts 2,731 RE: Oil Heating, Hot water production and plumbing “funnies” in France Quote: The plumber tendering for putting a boiler and central heating in our house came up with an alternative that would cost an extra 7,000 euros. I asked for a translation / explanation of what this was f... Generally operating a heat pump takes energy, though you get more out than you directly put in. The figures most often quoted are for every 1Kw (electricity) put in you get 4Kw out. Thus you will still get running costs, though these would be about a quarter of using electricity to get the heat. (My understanding at least). Ian Copyright Deimos. All rights reserved    Report

26/07/2005, 23:12 VJ Joined on 15/11/2005 Posts 97 RE: Oil Heating, Hot water production and plumbing “funnies” in France oft-solder is not allowed on Sanitary fittings here. You must use lead-free, which means 97% Tin - Hard solder. STATEMENT WAS I DID NOT KNOW WHAT PRESUURE SOFT SOLDER WOULD STAND THANK YOU FOR EXPLANATION generally between 5 and 7 bar. Soft-Solder at 65deg C is only specified to 7 bar. LEAD FREE IS STANDARD ACROSS EUROPE IS IT NOT STANDARD TO FIT A PRV AFTER THE INCOMING ISOLATION VALVE TO REDUCE THE PRESSURE TO 3 BAR? Soft solder is fine for Central Heating and is widely used, for ease and cost. I have also mentioned the need for an inhibitor, and these are available with/without an antifreeze in them. Provided the system is adequately insulated, there should be no problems with freezing. We always use two frost stats, one sensing the air near the boiler if that is sited in an outbuilding or similar, and one on the return pipe in the form of a pipe stat. I'm not sure why the RCB should trip - the Central Heating should be on its own 6A breaker.... RESIDUAL CIRCUIT BREAKER (NOT CIRCUIT BREAKER) OR YOU MAVE HAVE A DIFFERENT TERM. IF YOU LEAVE YOUR HOME UNATTENDED FOR A PERIOD OF TIME IN THE WINTER THEN AN ELECTRIC STORM MAY TRIP IT RENDERING THE STATS INOPERATIVE    Report

27/07/2005, 8:52 Opel Fruit Joined on 20/03/2005 Posts 339 RE: Oil Heating, Hot water production and plumbing “funnies” in France Never known a quality MCB trip due to a storm. MCBs are designed to trip if the load exceeds a certain current for a certain time. They are thermal devices, too, so not "sensitive".  How a storm causes the load to increase is absolutely beyond me. In the worst case, a BIG central heating system would draw less than 2A (about 460W). If you have a 6A MCB, how the heck do you more than treble the current draw? I think someone's been to listen to the old wives... Opel Fruit, Dept. 53    Report

27/07/2005, 9:46 VJ Joined on 15/11/2005 Posts 97 RE: Oil Heating, Hot water production and plumbing “funnies” in France Never known a quality RCB trip due to a storm. RCBs are designed to trip if the load exceeds a certain current for a certain time. They are thermal devices, too, so not "sensitive". How a storm causes the load to increase is absolutely beyond me. In the worst case, a BIG central heating system would draw less than 2A (about 460W). If you have a 6A RCB, how the heck do you more than treble the current draw? I think someone's been to listen to the old wives... Sorry Opel fruit but not the case we are not as explained talking MCB but RCB or RCD you have highlighted MCB 1 MCB Minature circuit breaker works on overload and thermal device 2 RCB or RCD Residual current device works on earth fault leakage due to detection of different amperage detected in the incoming phase and return neutral Available in standard 10 ma 30 ma 100 ma 300 ma which is selected for safety and calculated on Loop impedance test 3 RCBO Combination of both the above It is common in electric storms to have a RCB or RCBO to trip A possible addition to the above would be a voltage surge protector which are fitted on the Din rail and wired according to manufactures spec If you require more info collect Le Grande catalogue and full tech spec given of all the above PS I have a young wife !!!!!    Report

27/07/2005, 12:11 Opel Fruit Joined on 20/03/2005 Posts 339 RE: Oil Heating, Hot water production and plumbing “funnies” in France As I said, never known an RCB or MCB or RCBO or ELCB or whatever trip during storms. Even the one from last year on the 8th August, which was the worst here on record for some years. Anyway, this thread was intended to be a plumbing/heating thread... Opel Fruit, Dept. 53    Report

19/08/2005, 8:29 Jc Joined on 23/08/2004 Posts 752 RE: Oil Heating, Hot water production and plumbing “funnies” in France Interested to read all these remarks on copper plumbing because our local DIY shed(M.Bricolage)stocks vast numbers of compression fittings in the pipe sizes mentioned and not just connectors but adaptors(for changing pipe sizes and materials)and also bends and tees.And also they stock all these by three different manufacturers.    Report

20/08/2005, 19:39 Opel Fruit Joined on 20/03/2005 Posts 339 RE: Oil Heating, Hot water production and plumbing “funnies” in France Yes, you're right. Not sure why you thought they didn't? What you do find is the ranges kept between different sheds is extremely variable. And in all cases, merchants are far cheaper. Opel Fruit, Dept. 53    Report

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