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French Education
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 01/02/2008, 14:46
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Deby
 
Joined on 23/08/2004
Posts 641
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Re: Did you educate your children in France? What jobs are they doing now?
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The family is wealthy, well educated, motivated and my belle mere was Maire of a big town in Brittany. They have all the advantages it is possible for a french kid to have, money, contacts, influence, you name it. Any English kid who gets an incorporated position here has acheived something quite remarkable. Getting a real job in France for a school/university leaver is almost impossible.
I am truly shocked by this. I really hope France will make it much easier for their youth to find jobs. As an outsider looking in surely they need to make employing people easier. When you think of statistics both for UK and France are similar in terms of GDP etc, the French are obviously doing something right!
I know I have my opinions based on my own personal experiences and for those that live in France raising families I do admire you and you all have your very own personal reasons and success stories. Who knows whether returning to the UK for us as a family is the best route or for those that raise children in France. I think time will only tell. I think we will all have our own successes and failures. After all we are all different.
Deby
http://www.chateau-de-clerac.com
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12/02/2008, 12:06
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groslard
Joined on 26/12/2007
Posts 255
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Re: Did you educate your children in France? What jobs are they doing now?
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My son wasn't educated here, but did live and work here for four years after age 18. One of my jobs was also to prepare French young people aged 18-30 for working in an English speaking country , usually the UK but inceasingly Ireland and Canada, which has obvious appeal because of Québec. I hate large generalisations about 'the French/English' etc, so I will limit myself to impressions.
Some of the tendencies I found were these:
The French education system tends to put academic knowledge before practical application, so in languages there is a lot of learning about rather than using, and more emphasis on reading and writing than on speaking and listening, and in Music there is a lot of study of 'solfège' rather than playing the instrument for fun. This also tends to stifle discussion, because the students have to learn a lot of second-hand information. I used to joke that a French child had to learn the names of all the parts of a bike and then got a certificate in cycling before he went away to fall off when he tried to ride it.
At the same time, perhaps because of this, a lot of emphasis is put on how many years of study have been completed, and the value of a job is measured in Bac+2/3/4/5 etc. They are also obsessed with the marks they got which they assume will ensure a job for life.
This is why there are students at 25+ and not only on courses like medecine.
The problem with all this is that a young person coming out of the system at 25 is ill equipped for the world of work, or anyworld outside the narrow academic one where their value is measured by 'notes'. French students are much less likely than UK ones to have taken a GAP year ot to have travelled. They often expect to find a job in their home town and are less willing to move to find work.
The system also seems to be aimed at preparing students for a life in the 'fonction publique'. The brightest are encouraged to go the 'Grandes Ecoles' , and others encouraged to take the 'concours'. I sometimes think that the system wants to turn out teachers of History and Geography. The "aggrégation" examination for this is fiendishly difficult, and carries enormous kudos in France.
There is very little emphasis on starting a business, (not surpising given the complications) and very little ideas of relationship between what is studied, and whether it could possibly lead to a job. The 'profs' have something to answer for here, because they don't want to lose good students, so they give utopian advice about what to study, without reference to the world of work.
I dealt with a graduate in Arts Administration who could barely type, and had a very individual grasp of English , but wanted to work in London at one of the Museums.
We managed to find her a job selling postcards in a Museum shop..
On the positive side I found many students who were used to working enormously hard and for long hours, who were knowlegeable, polite, and had good IT skills.
My students weren't typical, because they were trying to do something about the lack of jobs in France by going abroad; and my son is not typical in that after 4 years in France and several years travelling round the world and working for quite long periods in places like Israel and South America he finally settled back in the UK with a foreign wife.
I think the answer lies in being flexible, being prepared to travel, and not to expect a job to fall from the skies.
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12/02/2008, 12:25
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Cathy
Joined on 07/03/2006
Mostly near Bordeaux; Sometimes near Bristol
Posts 2,007
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Re: Did you educate your children in France? What jobs are they doing now?
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Groslard - thanks for some thought provoking comments. It's such a shame that it isn't easier to set up businesses here.
Cathy
-----
Your children won't remember you ironing their pyjamas but they will remember you reading them a bedside story.
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12/02/2008, 16:27
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5-element
Joined on 28/10/2006
Languedoc
Posts 977
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Re: Did you educate your children in France? What jobs are they doing now?
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The last I overheard on the subject, was from a rather posh French lady (she runs a big branch of Secours Catholique in my area) talking about her nephew. He fully trained as an engineer and qualified rather brilliantly, but could not find work and is now....packing carrots.
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12/02/2008, 18:34
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Joanna
Joined on 01/02/2008
Posts 25
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Re: Did you educate your children in France? What jobs are they doing now?
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 5-element wrote: | | The last I overheard on the subject, was from a rather posh French lady (she runs a big branch of Secours Catholique in my area) talking about her nephew. He fully trained as an engineer and qualified rather brilliantly, but could not find work and is now....packing carrots. |
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Yes, I also know someone like that except that he went to a grande ecole and studied a much in demand type of science - (all this from his mother incidentally). And the reason he is currently working as a cabinet maker in the black? Not because of lack of job offers but because he flatly refuses to move from Bordeaux and there have never been any jobs of the type he trained for in this region.
A straw poll amongst my children (aged 19, 21 & 24) suggests that every one of their friends whoisn't currently in education and wants to work has a job, albeit not always a perfect one. All their friends who've done BTS's have found work too which should encourage those of you who have kids doing BTS's.
As far as the young French girl who claimed you had to do a training course to be a waitress I must respectfully say Rubbish! There's plenty of work out there, especially in the larger cities, and according to my eldest daughter who supplements her bourse by waitressing conditions in French restaurants are better and the staff are also better paid than restuarants in Scotland (where she worked this summer).
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France Forum » Living » French Educatio... » Re: Did you educate your children in France? What jobs are they doing now?
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