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15/05/2008, 11:27 Helen Joined on 15/05/2008 Posts 3 Employment Worries!! Hi All My husband and I have always wanted to move to France, and are determined to do it within the next few years. We have two small children to consider also..... I can speak French fluently but my husband does not. I am not too concerned for myself working, but my husband is not a natural linguist -but is willing to learn. He is, however, an Architect - which I feel should stand him in fairly good stead on some level! Am I being a little naiive to assume he will be able to work with very limited language skills intially?? We have had various other ideas such as about just running gites/B&Bs etc - but capital may be an issue as we do not want to take out a huge mortgage or end up watching our capital draining away in renovation costs, and the seemingly massive social costs of setting up a business in France are putting me off a little? My other idea was for him to offer english speaking architectural services to ex-pats - whilst I could do the translation/liaison works? I would love to hear from any families who have moved out to France with similar fears and concerns, or to hear any advice.... Thanks Helen          Report

15/05/2008, 11:36 sweet 17 Joined on 05/08/2006 charente maritime Posts 2,045 Re: Employment Worries!! Why doesn't your husband check with RIBA in the UK and they will probably put him in touch with the French arm? If he's going to be self-employed, it will be the Professional Indemnity people who will most likely be the sticking point.    Report

16/05/2008, 9:53 Helen Joined on 15/05/2008 Posts 3 Re: Employment Worries!! thanks for that, we certainly will do that. is PI insurance hard to get for sole traders out there?    Report

16/05/2008, 10:44 Cerise Joined on 23/08/2004 Laguepie Tarn & Garonne Posts 695 Re: Employment Worries!! I think it would be difficult for your husband to work unless you worked together.  Architects have to deal with issues like planning and all the relevant bodies speak French.  It is not impossible, but difficult for even those who are fluent in French to find work unless you are in a big city - which may not fit in with your ideas of a more relaxed life style.  My advice would be to allow enough money to live on for at least 2 years to get settled and to realise that you are likely to have a much lower standard of living for some time.  French wages are generally lower than comparable UK ones and expenses are about the same. Setting up anything here is quite complicated and it can be very frustrating not being able to get employment.  If you would not want to be a cleaner or factory worker in UK then you are unlikely to want to do so in France once the novelty has worn off.  I know 2 English architects who have set up in France but they both had excellent French on arrival.  Could your husband work on his French for a while before you make the plunge.  I think it would make your lives easier.      Report

16/05/2008, 11:43 Helen Joined on 15/05/2008 Posts 3 Re: Employment Worries!! Hi There Thanks for the advice, we would probably want to work on this as a joint business venture - and are fully prepared to take a massive salary cut! Given that we are not intending to move imminently I think it will be off to night school for him for a few years to learn as much French as he can as you suggest - is that what your two architect friends did? We don't necessarily want to live in the middle of nowhere as I know many Brits do - I would not be opposed to living near or even in a town but my husband is a very keen surfer so it would have to be near the coast! I am a recruitment consultant and my company does have offices in many major French cities - which would seem very sensible, but I am trying to avoid doing this as it would be a lifestyle change for us. Maybe I would be well-advised to work for them if I can for the first couple of years?? My other ideas were teaching English as a foreign language or setting up a yoga school..... Lots of ideas - we just need to commit to one! Thanks Helen        Report

16/05/2008, 15:20 Cerise Joined on 23/08/2004 Laguepie Tarn & Garonne Posts 695 Re: Employment Worries!! Hi Helen If you really want to move to France then seize any possible employment opportunity.  If your present company will employ you then I would do that until you get the rest of life sorted out.  For anything else think diploma, diploma, diploma.  The French are super keen on qualifications so for teaching anything you need to make sure you have the right qualifications - try to find out about the things you might want to do before you come and see what qualifications are needed and whether there is a Britich equivalent (not all UK qualifications are recognised).  Try to get a French CV sorted out.  Moving about is not considered 'flexible' as in the UK but often 'unstable' so if you have had a lot of jobs you might want to 'lose' a few.  This is not being negative.  We have been here for 6 years and the biggest disappointment for me has been the inflexibility for working.  I could not imagine being unemployed in UK (and I've moved house, region and career several times) - I'd say that in UK if you want to work you can.  That is just not so here and I know several very well qualified French folk who have been searching for jobs for ages.  Aged 47 on arrival, companies wouldn't even take my CV as I'm too old, live too far away etc etc.  There is also a peculiar mindset which says that if someone highly qualified takes a lowly job they are damaging their future prospects. I sincerely wish you well, but would advise anyone with a family to support to think employment prospects first and other aspects second.  I've seen several families run out of money and it doesn't look much fun!     Report

16/05/2008, 16:05 NormanH Joined on 10/04/2008 Posts 179 Re: Employment Worries!! Cerise is giving excellent advice here. I  worked in France from  the mid 90s, until last year and have never really got a job that reflects the sort of work I   was doing in the UK, for the sort of reasons quoted, but in fact my last decent job before retiring was training French graduates who wanted to go to work in the UK primarily London, so I saw things from the other side . Despite EU regulations UK qualifications (or indeed paperwork in general) are often misunderstood in France, and anything you can get together that reflects the French way of doing things will help. There is an emphasis on how many years of study you have done, expressed in "Bac+ and a number" , and much less emphasis on transferable skills. There tends to be a narrow specialized  view of career too, which means that a person employed in one field is regarded as unable to do other work which in the UK would be seen as close to the original. French secondary teachers of some minority subjects  for example are up in arms at the idea they might have to teach something else or re-train, whereas in the UK there are various career paths open to teachers. In terms of learning French, by applying what I found for French people going to the UK I can say that your husband should not just concentrate on technical French. I had students who were qualified pharmacists, accountants, and engineers, and I have also taught medical professionals. In almost every case the technical language didn't really pose major problems. 'Une ortite' is very like ortitis... It is the spoken language of everyday communication which will have to be used from the first day in the workplace with people who don't share the same level of technical expertise that can 'block' , so preferably find a real French teacher who has worked in a real job or in business, and not one who has only ever studied French in a linguistic way. FLE (French as a Foreign language ) exams and courses are covered in an introductory way here      Report

17/05/2008, 9:27 SaligoBay Joined on 23/08/2004 uncharted outer reaches of Montpellier Agglo Posts 2,951 Re: Employment Worries!! Cerise and NormanH are spot on. If you can get a decent, well-paid job with ANYONE in France, take it!   Minimum wage is okay while it's a novelty, but as Cerise says, don't bank on it being an "opportunity" in any way.  It's minimum wage work, point final, and if it's your only income, it's no way to live.          One may tolerate a world of demons for the sake of an angel.    Report

18/05/2008, 7:46 P-D de Rouffignac Joined on 14/03/2007 Posts 75 Re: Employment Worries!! The problem with certain occupations is not just the language - someone has spoken of learning (technical) French - but different national regulations. Doctors and dentists are probably fortunate in that their professions can cross national barriers, teeth and body parts are much the same in any language. But for archiects and engineers, and occupatons such as plumbing, electrics etc,  there are complex questions such as French building regulations. Much the same for accountants and tax specialists, and of course lawyers. A knowledge of the French language is just one requirement along with experience - and if appropriate training and a period of probation - before you could expect to be accepted into qualifying bodies such as DPLG for architects or the Ordre des avocats for lawyers. So, sadty, as someone has pointed out you may end up doing something in France that is fairly remote from your original British training and qualifications. P-D de Rouffignac www.francemediterraneanproperty.com    Report

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