Re
Finally, if your French healthcare cover is courtesy of an E-form, then you are exempt from social charges (contributions sociales) on your UK company and old age pensions. So, on the 2047 section VIII REVENUS DE SOURCE ÉTRANGÈRE SOUMIS EN FRANCE À L’IMPÔT SUR LE REVENU ET IMPOSABLES À LA CONTRIBUTION POUR LE REMBOURSEMENT DE LA DETTE SOCIALE (C.R.D.S.) - just write in 'Titulaire de formulaire E121 (or whichever E-form you have), donc je ne suis pas a la charge de l'assurance maladie' and leave the amount box blank.
My wife turned big 60 during the course of the 2007 tax year and she applied for, received and registered her E121 with the CPAM with me as her dependant. We then received a letter from the URSSAF indicating that the « radiation » of our « compte au regime general de securite social sous condition de residence (cmu) » was with effect from 30/06/07. From that date our three monthly payments ceased. I intend to include a copy of this letter with our tax return. I am not sure on what part of our income CRDS is charged but whilst our pensions are regular throughout the year other sources of income like building society interest, annual, premium bond prizes, sadly small, are not. My question what can I do to make it more likely that the tax office takes the appropriate action in calculating the correct CRDS as monies entered on the form are not dated. My experience in the past has been that if it is too difficult they just ignore extra information and charge what they think. Had this last year as they totally ignored tax paid on my teachers pension in the UK, got it back in the end but only after a bit of a fight and help from a site member!
And
What about pensions based on an annuity - is this going to be a problem?
A No - they just have to be entered differently.. Enter the gross amounts on form 2047 section I. RENTES VIAGERS DE TITRE ONEREUX then transfer them across to the 2042 and into box AW, BW, CW or DW dependent on your age when the annuities were taken out. The social charges are calculated directly from this, so no need for any additional entry on forms 2047 or 2042.
I have heard that the tax people may want evidence that contributions were only made by us and no one else. What form would this evidence take and should I include it with the tax forms as a matter of course. I used to lump these in with our other pensions in the past and thanks to info on this and other sites have only just found out, again thanks to a site member, that I should have declared them in RENTES VIAGERS DE TITRE ONEREUX with, I hope, some tax advantage.
Finally form 2042
I have used box TI for my net teachers pension and box TK for the sum of a firms pension before I went into teaching and my wifes firms pension plus her state pension. I have put details of these on form 2047.What about box TL (2042), should anything go in there.
I must say that I find the French tax thing most confusing and my only consolation is that even if I get it wrong I should not be out of pocket as much as if I paid an accountant to do it for me and I say this from personal experience!.......................................J
CRDS is charged at 0.5% of your taxable income, if you are not covered by an E form. You can pro rata your income to cover the period for which CRDS is due, if you wish. but that might complicate things Other sociale charges on unearned income such as interest from savings etc are not exempt by having an E Form.
Your gross private pension goes in box TL as it says in the FAQ NOT in TK If it is taxed in the UK you will have to get it back from the UK.
Your teacher's pension taxed in the UK goes in box TI and is not subject to tax in France but will be taken into account when establishing the tax band of the income that is taxable in France.
Why not post a sensible answer, people will appreciate it more
Jackie wrote: Re Finally, if your French healthcare cover is courtesy of an E-form, then you are exempt from social charges (contributions sociales) on your UK company and old age pensions. So, on the 2047 section VIII REVENUS DE SOURCE ÉTRANGÈRE SOUMIS EN FRANCE À L’IMPÔT SUR LE REVENU ET IMPOSABLES À LA CONTRIBUTION POUR LE REMBOURSEMENT DE LA DETTE SOCIALE (C.R.D.S.) - just write in 'Titulaire de formulaire E121 (or whichever E-form you have), donc je ne suis pas a la charge de l'assurance maladie' and leave the amount box blank. My wife turned big 60 during the course of the 2007 tax year and she applied for, received and registered her E121 with the CPAM with me as her dependant. We then received a letter from the URSSAF indicating that the « radiation » of our « compte au regime general de securite social sous condition de residence (cmu) » was with effect from 30/06/07. From that date our three monthly payments ceased. I intend to include a copy of this letter with our tax return. I am not sure on what part of our income CRDS is charged but whilst our pensions are regular throughout the year other sources of income like building society interest, annual, premium bond prizes, sadly small, are not. My question what can I do to make it more likely that the tax office takes the appropriate action in calculating the correct CRDS as monies entered on the form are not dated. My experience in the past has been that if it is too difficult they just ignore extra information and charge what they think. Had this last year as they totally ignored tax paid on my teachers pension in the UK, got it back in the end but only after a bit of a fight and help from a site member! The calculation of tax and social charges is determined upon which boxes you put the relevent information in. As explained in the FAQ, foreign earnings and pensions taxable in France (ie, your non-teaching pensions) are subject to CRDS except where you hold an E-form (or have private insurance). Assuming you were registered for CMU prior to 30/06/2007, then you enter the sum of your non teaching pensions for the whole year in boxes AS/BS (that's for the tax bit), then split the total into that received prior to 30/06/2007 and that received after. The pre June amount is additionally entered in box TL (that generates the CRDS charge due for that slice of income) and the rest goes nowhere because there's no charge applicable. There is no need to include a copy of your URSSAF letter with your declaration. As stated previously, just mention the fact that you hold an E121 on your 2047. And What about pensions based on an annuity - is this going to be a problem? A No - they just have to be entered differently.. Enter the gross amounts on form 2047 section I. RENTES VIAGERS DE TITRE ONEREUX then transfer them across to the 2042 and into box AW, BW, CW or DW dependent on your age when the annuities were taken out. The social charges are calculated directly from this, so no need for any additional entry on forms 2047 or 2042. I have heard that the tax people may want evidence that contributions were only made by us and no one else. What form would this evidence take and should I include it with the tax forms as a matter of course. I used to lump these in with our other pensions in the past and thanks to info on this and other sites have only just found out, again thanks to a site member, that I should have declared them in RENTES VIAGERS DE TITRE ONEREUX with, I hope, some tax advantage. No need to include annuity information with your tax declaration, just keep all the backup stuff. Now that you've got it right, you'll find you get better tax relief on these. Finally form 2042 I have used box TI for my net teachers pension and box TK for the sum of a firms pension before I went into teaching and my wifes firms pension plus her state pension. I have put details of these on form 2047.What about box TL (2042), should anything go in there. Box TI is correct for your teacher's pension - income not taxable in France, but taken into account for calculating the marginal rate on your taxable income. For your other pensions, Box TK is incorrect - it's for income taxable abroad which qualifies for a French tax credit equal to the amount of foreign tax paid. As explained above (and in the FAQ), your other pensions go elsewhere. I must say that I find the French tax thing most confusing and my only consolation is that even if I get it wrong I should not be out of pocket as much as if I paid an accountant to do it for me and I say this from personal experience!.......................................J If you follow the advice set out in the FAQ, you'll find your tax situation is very straightforward and quite simple to declare here.
The calculation of tax and social charges is determined upon which boxes you put the relevent information in.
As explained in the FAQ, foreign earnings and pensions taxable in France (ie, your non-teaching pensions) are subject to CRDS except where you hold an E-form (or have private insurance). Assuming you were registered for CMU prior to 30/06/2007, then you enter the sum of your non teaching pensions for the whole year in boxes AS/BS (that's for the tax bit), then split the total into that received prior to 30/06/2007 and that received after. The pre June amount is additionally entered in box TL (that generates the CRDS charge due for that slice of income) and the rest goes nowhere because there's no charge applicable.
There is no need to include a copy of your URSSAF letter with your declaration. As stated previously, just mention the fact that you hold an E121 on your 2047.
No need to include annuity information with your tax declaration, just keep all the backup stuff. Now that you've got it right, you'll find you get better tax relief on these.
Box TI is correct for your teacher's pension - income not taxable in France, but taken into account for calculating the marginal rate on your taxable income. For your other pensions, Box TK is incorrect - it's for income taxable abroad which qualifies for a French tax credit equal to the amount of foreign tax paid. As explained above (and in the FAQ), your other pensions go elsewhere.
If you follow the advice set out in the FAQ, you'll find your tax situation is very straightforward and quite simple to declare here.
Thanks for coming back Ron. I am somewhat confused as I have put Private pensions on form 2047 page 4 section VI (at the suggestion of someone who writes about tax matters on the other site and with whom I shall have speaks) and teachers pension section in section VII. Under the total box section VI it says à reporter Ligne 8TK de la declaration des revenus. So from what you are saying I should delete what I have put in VI (2047) and leave the teachers pension in VII (2047). Do I not then enter the private pensions for myself and my wife at all on 2047 other than the front page but just enter the total of these in box TL on 2042 (up to 30/06/2007). I take it I just write what has been suggested in Tax FAQS in VIII (2047). My teachers pension is the only one I pay tax on in the UK..............J
ooh just seen reply from Sunday Driver so will study and take appropriate action..............J
PS Thanks to Sunday driver have taken action suggested.........J
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