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30/03/2007, 21:35 Gyn_Paul Joined on 23/08/2004 La Creuse - God's own Dept. Posts 1,160 Re: Boiler heating hot water or not?  ErnieY wrote: Thanks, though so, I know that pressurised systems are the norm in France but are they mandatory and would it actually be illegal to fit say a UK type system with storage tank & "ballon" etc. One can argue of course that nothing is illegal until you get caught and there's probably little chance of that in one's own cellar but there is the insurance side of it to consider. The boiler in my house is about 15 years old and although it's in good working order the whole system seems horribly inefficient as witnessed by the amount of oil it consumes v the hot water and heating it produces, most of which clearly is down to the limited storage capacity. The system used to have a ballon but at some time it was removed and the pipes capped off so it would be a very easy job to refit one. I have had oil heating in the UK for the last 20 years (non condensating boilers) so have got a pretty good idea of annual consumtion but this byzantine monster gobbles about double what I would expect and is noisy to boot, not to mention taking up something like 4x the floor space of a conventional UK one. I have considered bypassing the whole thing, replacing it with a UK type system but leaving the old boiler in place so that, come the day I might want to sell, I could revert back to the French system quite easily if neccessary. First of all, the burner of a UK oil boiler wouldn't work over here because - unlike in the UK - the CH oil in France is actually farmer's red diesel. Secondly, why would you want to install a British system which would ensure you had such a pathertic dribble out of the taps that you couldn't have a decent shower ? (quite apart from it probably being ilegal!) We may not have everything right over this side of the channel, but a simple, efficient hot water system which give you a decent shower is certainly one of them. "Don't think of them as problems, think of them as opportunities." "OK, I think I've hit an insurmountable opportunity!"    Report

05/04/2007, 15:55 Gluestick Joined on 22/03/2006 UK and Nord Pas de Calais Posts 2,341 Re: Boiler heating hot water or not? What is really the point in even considering "A UK type system................." when: 1.    They are more expensive: 2.    Any warranty and/or service problems would mean de-mounting the boiler and taking it back to the UK for service? 3.    UK systems are rapidly emulating continental systems: it's just that we- as always - call them by a different name. In this case, Combi boilers. Condensing Combi boilers - which indeed work as a sealed system at mains water pressure - are little different from French systems. Both normally have a reserve DHW storage vessel. As already pointed out, UK fuel (Burning Oil) has a different Specific Gravity to French Red Diesel - or Fuile - thus the two systems are not interchangable. Finally, there is the little matter of French regulations and perhaps more importantly, insurance acceptance. As French property law is increasingly tightened up, it will probably prove important - if not critical  - to ensure conformity to French regs for a successful sale. Why make life hard? I often suspect that this repeating insistence on "UK type/UK Regs" is a corollary for "Don't understand this French plumbing/wiring stuff.............." It is not hard nor is it rocket science. Opal Fruit has taken huge trouble to lay out the basics at the beginning of this thread. This is a wonderful and very valuable resource. Additionally, other members are only too happy to offer their learned experience and hard won advice. Stick with the programme, Ernie; update or replace. Make life simple. "Yes, but that apart, Mrs Lincoln, did you enjoy the play?" Gluestick    Report

30/10/2007, 19:50 Poolguy Joined on 25/12/2004 Charante Maritime Posts 746 Re: Boiler heating hot water or not? Why would you consider evacuated tube solar panels for hot water and space heating. Its free after you've done the installation..... forever. Doesn't matter what the barrel price is doing. Looks good to me. Andrew www.Poolguy.fr    Report

30/10/2007, 22:47 Gyn_Paul Joined on 23/08/2004 La Creuse - God's own Dept. Posts 1,160 Re: Boiler heating hot water or not? I intend to use an evac tube system for the DHW eventually, but space heating? ??   I know they generate some heat even on overcast days, but sufficient to make a difference? I'd be very interested to hear of any working space heating systems in central france. p "Don't think of them as problems, think of them as opportunities." "OK, I think I've hit an insurmountable opportunity!"    Report

03/11/2007, 9:37 Poolguy Joined on 25/12/2004 Charante Maritime Posts 746 Re: Boiler heating hot water or not? I am just about to install them on my house, once the permit comes through, I will let you know how it gets on. Naturally, the times you need the most heat (winter nights) there is little or no radiation around, so you need more panels and larger storage to last through the night. But each panel can generate up to 20 kw so is going to get the job done so long as you not heating a chateau  in le Loire. We have an in-line gas heater feeding radiators and DHW so the solar system will feed with already heated water, so conseqently my gas consumption goes down considerably. Payback for me should be 3 years, afterthat its money in the bank ....  I like it. Andrew www.Poolguy.fr    Report

26/11/2007, 23:16 robbie Joined on 18/06/2006 Posts 60 Re: Boiler heating hot water or not? just to change tac a little on this thread. I have just bought our first house in france which does have central heating and a seperate electric hot water tank. The oil burner for the heating does not heat the water tank. I have a few questions:- 1. Do the hot water tanks all have prepared connectors for utilising the oil boiler or are there two types, one with connections and one without, similar to the UK where you have tanks without the coils or with. 2. The central heating boiler is manually switched on via what looks like a two pole switch on the wall alongside the boiler. I would like to place a timer device on this to allow me to keep the house aired while we are not there during the winter. What would a typical current be for the boiler?? Can I purchase a timer from the UK without contravening any French rules/Regs/Insurance. I have no issue in completing the timer install, just need to know I can do it with stuff I know and this thread suggests it is cheaper from the UK too) 3. Would the timer be used to directly switch on the boiler in line from the two pole switch?? It seems simpler in the UK as you have clearly defined connections on the boilers and it is the first time I have worked on oil fired boilers.    Report

27/11/2007, 8:30 andyh4 Joined on 15/06/2005 Frankfurt and Ardèche Posts 845 Re: Boiler heating hot water or not?  robbie wrote: just to change tac a little on this thread. I have just bought our first house in france which does have central heating and a seperate electric hot water tank. The oil burner for the heating does not heat the water tank. I have a few questions:- 1. Do the hot water tanks all have prepared connectors for utilising the oil boiler or are there two types, one with connections and one without, similar to the UK where you have tanks without the coils or with. Both types are available but in my expereince it is somewhat harder to find those with an inderect heating coil 2. The central heating boiler is manually switched on via what looks like a two pole switch on the wall alongside the boiler. I would like to place a timer device on this to allow me to keep the house aired while we are not there during the winter. What would a typical current be for the boiler?? Can I purchase a timer from the UK without contravening any French rules/Regs/Insurance. I have no issue in completing the timer install, just need to know I can do it with stuff I know and this thread suggests it is cheaper from the UK too) Don't do it.  Buy a french one, it will probably be cheaper. 3. Would the timer be used to directly switch on the boiler in line from the two pole switch?? It seems simpler in the UK as you have clearly defined connections on the boilers and it is the first time I have worked on oil fired boilers. Perhaps you should invest a few euros in an electrician.  If you don't know what you are doing then playing around with the power feed to yoour boiler may not be the best learning platform. Andy    Report

27/11/2007, 9:51 robbie Joined on 18/06/2006 Posts 60 Re: Boiler heating hot water or not? thaks for the advice, I have no issues in the wiring side of things, just need to make sure I get the correct components I guess. I will make a visit to my local plumber/heating merchant and see what they can offer. I would rather pay a little more for UK kit so I know I can get the job done without language barriers when I go back in a week or so. I only have 2 days there so need ot make sure it is done for when I leave cheers Rob    Report

27/11/2007, 11:37 ErnieY Joined on 05/12/2006 Nr Prayssac (Lot) Posts 2,938 Re: Boiler heating hot water or not? My boiler is just plugged into an ordinary 2 pin socket and I think for less than €10 I bought a mechanical timer to control it with so why not simply add a socket to your existing arrangment and do likewise. The downside of such a simple arrangement is that in the event of a power cut the timer will stop until power is restored and therefore go out of sync with real time. The way around that would be to buy a more comprehensive one with a backup battery. Your boiler should have a label on it somewhere stating it's rating but at worst it's unlikely to exceed a few hundred watts. My doctor said one drink per day, I can live with that !    Report

27/11/2007, 23:37 robbie Joined on 18/06/2006 Posts 60 Re: Boiler heating hot water or not? after much diggin around, I am going to install a timer/programmer (battery backed) and alongside this a frost stat/pipe stat configuration. This should give me the flexibility for a series of eventualities. All I need now is enough oil in the flaming tank!!! Thanks guys for your responses and suggestions. I am off to France in dec and will hopefully resolve this issue then. I just hope the frost hasnt done anything in the meanwhile :)    Report

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France Forum » Building and Re... » House Renovatio... » FAQ - Oil Heating, Hot water production and plumbing “funnies” in France

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