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18/04/2008, 11:09 Mike1958 Joined on 23/08/2004 Bagneres de Luchon Posts 143 SACEM - Is this a scam I have received a letter from SACEM who are saying that if we play music, or have the TV available to our guests that we have to pay a fee. Can anyone please advise whether this is correct? Many thanks in anticipation.    Report

18/04/2008, 11:38 Quillan Joined on 23/08/2004 Forum Moderator Posts 3,576 Re: SACEM - Is this a scam I did a search on SACEM and it does exist and it is (at an initial glance) about music etc and protecting musicians rights etc. I did a search within the site on Chambres d'hôtes and the were about 15 results but I don't have the time to read them all at the moment. You could check the name and address on the website and compare it against the letter you have received. It may be legit because if you think about it in letting your guests watch telly you are in fact, technically, entertaining them. Bit like putting on a DVD for them, you are then giving a 'public screening' which is breaking the terms of the agreement you had with the film company when you bought the DVD and play it. It is the sort of thing you never really think about and I am sure we have all put on the news, a footbal match or a 'soap' for a guest at some time or another. So, it's probably correct but worth checking out. http://www.chambresdhote.com    Report

18/04/2008, 13:29 Cat Joined on 21/01/2005 ------- Forum Moderator ------- Lot Posts 2,788 Re: SACEM - Is this a scam Here are the forum discussions about SACEM that Quillan mentioned... http://www.completefrance.com/cs/search/SearchResults.aspx?q=sacem&f=&u= Cathy Sun, sun, sun, here it comes...    Report

18/04/2008, 13:58 cassis Joined on 28/12/2007 Manhattan and Glasgow Posts 309 Re: SACEM - Is this a scam Hi Mike Seeing your message reminded me of a discussion I read on another forum some time ago on this subject - see here: http://www.toprural.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5258&highlight=sacem&page=5 That page is in the middle of the topic.  Picking the bones out of it, the argument on that forum seems to hinge on whether you're running a gite or a chambre d'hôte and do you pay taxe professionnelle.  But even then, there are conflicting viewpoints, natch!  Not only performing rights, but also extra TV licences are mentioned. La diffusion de musique et/ou d’images dans les lieux ouverts au public nécessite l’autorisation préalable de la SACEM et le paiement des redevances d’auteur. De plus, tout diffuseur devra acquitter la rémunération due aux artistes-interprètes et producteur de phonogramme dite «Droits Voisins» auprès de la SPRE. La redevance audiovisuelle s’applique par téléviseur ; son montant est évalué en fonction du nombre de postes et du lieu d’installation des appareils. Soooo .... is a chambre d'hôte or a gîte actually "a place open to the public"?  It's not like a café, is it?  But some regional authorities do seem to think that performing rights are payable - like this guideline published by the Vosges Tourist board, and the Ardennes board from which I lifted the quote above. http://www.tourismevosges.fr/ Zoggy played guitar, jammin' good with Weird and Golly. Lyrics copyright Sausage Music 2008    Report

18/04/2008, 14:20 cassis Joined on 28/12/2007 Manhattan and Glasgow Posts 309 Re: SACEM - Is this a scam The Gazette of Gites de France Alpes Haut-Provence also seem to think it is payable Here's a link to their first bulletin of this year and an extract thereof: www.gites-de-france Fiscal : Rappel——————————————————————————————————————————— la SACEM : Tout propriétaire en est redevable si les chambres et/ou les pièces communes sont équipées de télévision, chaîne HIFI ou tout autre appareil de diffusion. Redevance Audiovisuelle : Il se présente 3 cas possibles : 1. Soit les locaux sont soumis à la Taxe Professionnelle dans ce cas, la redevance est due pour chaque poste. 2. Soit les locaux sont soumis à la Taxe d’Habitation, dans ce cas une seule redevance est due quel que soit le nombre de poste. 3. Pour les structures qui seraient soumis au deux, le 1er cas s’applique. Zoggy played guitar, jammin' good with Weird and Golly. Lyrics copyright Sausage Music 2008    Report

18/04/2008, 16:49 nimportequoi Joined on 15/11/2005 Posts 496 Re: SACEM - Is this a scam I received a letter from them yesterday and don't know whether to pay it or not. I've got 3 gites and there are TV's in all of them, for which I already pay 320€ for redevance audiovisuelle. I really don't want to have to pay anymore on top of this.    Report

18/04/2008, 22:35 J.R's gone native Joined on 16/07/2006 Picardie, Sussex Posts 1,695 Re: SACEM - Is this a scam Bars, restaurants and brasseries have to pay or they cannot even play a radio, the tax is based on the number of seats/tables for customers including those outside and is quite hefty. It costs even more if they have a TV. How much are they trying to extort from you?    Report

19/04/2008, 7:18 nimportequoi Joined on 15/11/2005 Posts 496 Re: SACEM - Is this a scam On my letter, it says up to 3 bedrooms, 78,48HT, above 3 bedrooms, 156,92 HT. On the accompanying form it does state Chambre d'Hotes, so as I have gîtes, maybe they have sent it to me in error    Report

19/04/2008, 7:24 cassis Joined on 28/12/2007 Manhattan and Glasgow Posts 309 Re: SACEM - Is this a scam Whatever you do, don't suggest it was a mistake on their part.  Zoggy played guitar, jammin' good with Weird and Golly. Lyrics copyright Sausage Music 2008    Report

19/04/2008, 10:29 NormanH Joined on 10/04/2008 Posts 179 Re: SACEM - Is this a scam The SACEM are certainmy not scammers, and they don't joke! While I believe it is a private, not a Governlmental organisation you will need to have made the correct declarations to them if you have a "contrôl"    Report

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